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Help[Opinions] Re: generally ... eta +
in reply to a message by Tassiegirl
I agree with you that it seems snotty.
It's not the kind of thing that I would consider to be hateful, though. Because it doesn't aggressively assert that the God anyone else believes in is in fact a "sky-daddy," nor does it ridicule anyone directly for their belief. It indicates a superior attitude, yeah - but they're stopping short of saying explicitly (even if metaphorically or jokingly) that they think it could be appropriate and OK to openly disrespect *people* for their beliefs. It's one thing to scoff at a belief, it's another to scoff at the people who believe.
Having been an atheist myself ... not so much anymore! but neither can I claim to be religious ... I think they could as well have been trying to express a reason why they don't believe (because they don't understand God as anything but a sky-daddy), but without coming off as disrespectful to people who believe. I personally read that kind of comment as sort of a boomerang, because if they do mean to scoff at other people's belief, it just shows that they are ignorant about what is believed.
I hope you don't feel that the liberty atheists have, to specify what they "don't believe" in their own words, amounts to permission to denigrate religious people including you. I don't think it does. If you can find any instance of someone saying that another person's religious belief is just a belief in a sky-daddy and doesn't deserve respect, I'd be interested to see it.
eta I think there have been discussions in which people have given their opinion that religion is false and went on to state that all believers are willfully ignorant and it's just wish fulfillment etc. And I think you'd be right, if you thought that a religious person making analogous statements about atheists would be, ah, "user moderated" out of the discussion.
If people think it's appropriate for a board moderator here to interfere with that, then we need to ask Mike to get a moderator who enjoys power more than I do. I can't control the philosophical constituency of the board and if there are a lot of vocal atheists and only quiet religious, am I really to be held responsible for equalizing the discussion? I never signed up for that.
I would defend a religious person's liberty to give their perspective on atheism reciprocally, if they did. (Wouldn't that be something if they did)
I can stick my neck out to "defend silent vegans" because the language was clearly in a hateful form, I didn't need to have an opinion about vegans to do that ... and because I'm no vegan, I have no dog in the fight, and I'm on record being skeptical of vegans already. So no accusation of bias is possible. That's not true in the area of religion; it would become personal unless I can find language that is clearly in a hate-form.
It's possible that I've let haterish language from atheists slide, I admit. But the reason is definitely not a bias in favor of atheists or against religion!
It might be just that I've never been religious, and so I'm less able to estimate how offensive atheist language might be to religious people. I hope that people will speak up more when they feel they're being denigrated unfairly by others. I read my PMs.
- mirfak
It's not the kind of thing that I would consider to be hateful, though. Because it doesn't aggressively assert that the God anyone else believes in is in fact a "sky-daddy," nor does it ridicule anyone directly for their belief. It indicates a superior attitude, yeah - but they're stopping short of saying explicitly (even if metaphorically or jokingly) that they think it could be appropriate and OK to openly disrespect *people* for their beliefs. It's one thing to scoff at a belief, it's another to scoff at the people who believe.
Having been an atheist myself ... not so much anymore! but neither can I claim to be religious ... I think they could as well have been trying to express a reason why they don't believe (because they don't understand God as anything but a sky-daddy), but without coming off as disrespectful to people who believe. I personally read that kind of comment as sort of a boomerang, because if they do mean to scoff at other people's belief, it just shows that they are ignorant about what is believed.
I hope you don't feel that the liberty atheists have, to specify what they "don't believe" in their own words, amounts to permission to denigrate religious people including you. I don't think it does. If you can find any instance of someone saying that another person's religious belief is just a belief in a sky-daddy and doesn't deserve respect, I'd be interested to see it.
eta I think there have been discussions in which people have given their opinion that religion is false and went on to state that all believers are willfully ignorant and it's just wish fulfillment etc. And I think you'd be right, if you thought that a religious person making analogous statements about atheists would be, ah, "user moderated" out of the discussion.
If people think it's appropriate for a board moderator here to interfere with that, then we need to ask Mike to get a moderator who enjoys power more than I do. I can't control the philosophical constituency of the board and if there are a lot of vocal atheists and only quiet religious, am I really to be held responsible for equalizing the discussion? I never signed up for that.
I would defend a religious person's liberty to give their perspective on atheism reciprocally, if they did. (Wouldn't that be something if they did)
I can stick my neck out to "defend silent vegans" because the language was clearly in a hateful form, I didn't need to have an opinion about vegans to do that ... and because I'm no vegan, I have no dog in the fight, and I'm on record being skeptical of vegans already. So no accusation of bias is possible. That's not true in the area of religion; it would become personal unless I can find language that is clearly in a hate-form.
It's possible that I've let haterish language from atheists slide, I admit. But the reason is definitely not a bias in favor of atheists or against religion!
It might be just that I've never been religious, and so I'm less able to estimate how offensive atheist language might be to religious people. I hope that people will speak up more when they feel they're being denigrated unfairly by others. I read my PMs.
- mirfak
This message was edited 8/25/2018, 7:07 PM
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Replies
By no means am I looking to be defended against atheists.I was brought up in religion, and married into it,it's a way of life to me.Although certainly,I fail to live up to what I know is right, as often as I succeed.
As the old saying goes, "There are many paths up the mountain." We all choose what suits us best. If I find what someone says hurtful, then, that is my prompt to understand why feel as they do.
As the old saying goes, "There are many paths up the mountain." We all choose what suits us best. If I find what someone says hurtful, then, that is my prompt to understand why feel as they do.
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